My "Naturo" Friend
Posted: 30 Jun 2009, 19:40
So I have a friend I occassionally spar with on topics such as "why auras don't exist" and "people who don't vaccinate are socially irresponsible".
Most recent discourse (this is apparently huge, TLDR follows):
TLDR:
She thinks antibiotics are harmful, and I should take (what is effectively Yakult - fermented milk) to treat an infection.
Seriously, how can someone be opposed to antibiotics? Vaccination, maybe, I can forgive - although it's hard to look past the damage done by polio, even though it was way before my time.
But antibiotics? Really?
Most recent discourse (this is apparently huge, TLDR follows):
(5:12:22 PM) Annaleisa: hello sir
(5:12:26 PM) Annaleisa: how is everything?
(5:12:31 PM) Self: eh, not so bad
(5:12:40 PM) Self: you?
(5:12:46 PM) Annaleisa: i'm lovely thanks
(5:12:54 PM) Annaleisa: sure you're ok?
(5:13:34 PM) Self: yep. slightly sick - made an appointment to get some antibiotics
(5:13:52 PM) Self: i went two weeks ago and the doc was convinced it was just viral -.-
(5:13:57 PM) Self: otherwise fine
(5:14:19 PM) Annaleisa: sigh
(5:14:28 PM) Annaleisa: did you take some flora with your antibiotics?
(5:14:40 PM) Annaleisa: otherwise you kill allthe good stuff too
(5:14:41 PM) Self: i haven't been given any antibiotics yet
(5:14:53 PM) Annaleisa: ooh
(5:14:59 PM) Annaleisa: well i would advise against it
(5:15:03 PM) Self: but yeh, i'll knock back some yogurt or something
(5:15:22 PM) Annaleisa: if you take some flora (in the hardcore capsule form) it'll kill off the bad stuff
(5:15:31 PM) Annaleisa: works better than anit all of them
(5:15:34 PM) Annaleisa: anti**
(5:15:40 PM) Self: and what, pray tell, is flora?
(5:16:54 PM) Annaleisa: ultra flora sb dysbiosis.
(5:16:59 PM) Annaleisa: it's a probiotic
(5:17:35 PM) Self: that's great and all, but the infection i have is regular old bacteria - probably strep
(5:18:01 PM) Annaleisa: yup, so pro biotics will help your immune system fight it off
(5:18:16 PM) Self: that's not how immune systems work
(5:18:40 PM) Annaleisa: it's bacteria in your gut right?
(5:18:56 PM) Self: it's strep - the bacterial infection in this case occurs in my throat
(5:19:19 PM) Annaleisa: but it's still in your system
(5:19:54 PM) Self: what does that have to do with my immune system?
(5:20:55 PM) Annaleisa: if you have bacteria in your body
(5:21:04 PM) Annaleisa: then you're immune system isn't working properly is it?
(5:21:19 PM) Annaleisa: coz bad bacteria isn't meant to be there
(5:21:46 PM) Self: no, it means part of my body has become infected with bad bacteria; it doesn't have a lot to do with the working nature of my immune system
(5:22:06 PM) Self: which also doesn't have a lot to do with whether or not the stocks of "good" bacteria in my stomach are high or low
(5:22:43 PM) Annaleisa: actually it does. coz if you had lots of lovely good bacteria in your system, then you wouldn't still be sick.
(5:22:48 PM) Self: taking antibiotics will knock out a large number of the cultures in my system - including the good, hence yogurt can help a little if you're taking the antibiotics
(5:23:03 PM) Annaleisa: or ultra flora
(5:23:10 PM) Annaleisa: which is much better
(5:23:10 PM) Self: sweetie, can you tell me what the good bacteria actually do for me?
(5:23:17 PM) Self: the ones in my stomach?
(5:24:36 PM) Annaleisa: At first, probiotics were thought to beneficially affect the host by improving its intestinal microbial balance, thus inhibiting pathogens and toxin producing bacteria.
(5:24:57 PM) Annaleisa: when you're sick in one part of your body, it's not just in one part.
(5:25:06 PM) Annaleisa: it travels everywhere.
(5:25:20 PM) Self: except that that's bullshit
(5:25:30 PM) Self: i have an infection in the tissue of my throat
(5:25:38 PM) Self: the infection hasn't spread anywhere else
(5:25:42 PM) Self: it *can*, but it hasn't
(5:26:20 PM) Self: my immune system has learned to recognise the good bacteria in my gut - but that has little if anything to do with infections elsewhere in my body
(5:26:35 PM) Annaleisa: you're infected *.*
(5:26:53 PM) Self: if i cut my skin, and the wound becomes infected, it's infected in the wound
(5:27:14 PM) Annaleisa: and you have poison in your blood, which travels throughout your body.,
(5:27:18 PM) Self: the infection *can* spread, but if you treat it right and are relatively healthy, it won't
(5:27:34 PM) Self: yeh, but it can't actually do anything
(5:27:56 PM) Self: otherwise i'd be infected in all my tissue
(5:28:12 PM) Annaleisa: when you have a throat infection, you're whole body is full of bacteria, however it is most effected in your throat.
(5:28:38 PM) Annaleisa: so if you take stuff that helps good bacteria grow in your gut, it encorages your body to fight off the infection everwhere
(5:28:38 PM) Self: i appreciate the concepts put forth by holistic theories, but sometimes it really is just one part of the body that is the cause
(5:28:49 PM) Self: that doesn't make sense
(5:29:05 PM) Self: the stuff growing in my gut has nothing to do with the infection in my throat
(5:29:05 PM) Annaleisa: what happens when you swallow?
(5:29:14 PM) Self: it hurts
(5:29:16 PM) Self:
(5:29:26 PM) Annaleisa: so bacteria is in your gut.
(5:29:33 PM) Annaleisa: be realistic.
(5:29:43 PM) Self: so what?
(5:30:46 PM) Annaleisa: just treat your gut ok.
(5:30:55 PM) Annaleisa: i've been there, and done all the doctor crap
(5:30:57 PM) Annaleisa: and it's crap
(5:31:02 PM) Annaleisa: and you're not listening to me
(5:31:13 PM) Self: sweetie, just because you had a bad experience doesn't mean all medicine is wrong
(5:31:14 PM) Annaleisa: even though i've had far more experience with this sort of thing
(5:31:26 PM) Self: some doctors are assholes, just like any other profession
(5:31:26 PM) Annaleisa: i'm not saying doctors are crap
(5:31:45 PM) Annaleisa: i'm saying that i've had countelss infections
(5:31:57 PM) Annaleisa: and the best thing to do, to feel better (which is your aim)
(5:32:05 PM) Annaleisa: is fix your gut
(5:32:08 PM) Self: no, my aim is to kill the infection
(5:32:18 PM) Self: if i just wanted to feel better, i'd take analgesics
(5:32:29 PM) Self: if i don't take antiobiotics, this is liable to last for more than a month
(5:32:35 PM) Annaleisa: my understanding of better is healthy.
(5:32:42 PM) Self: bacterial infections aren't like viral infections
(5:33:04 PM) Self: if i leave this, or just take probiotics, it'll be with me for months
(5:33:12 PM) Self: if i take antiobiotics, it'll be gone within a week
(5:33:40 PM) Annaleisa: if you looked after your body, it wouldn't have been a problem to begin with
(5:33:51 PM) Annaleisa: (A)
(5:33:57 PM) Annaleisa: anyway, i have to go
(5:34:06 PM) Self: we can agree on that last part
(5:34:11 PM) Self: later miss
(5:34:12 PM) Annaleisa: hopefully the antibiotocs wont cause too much damage
(5:34:16 PM) Annaleisa:
(5:34:17 PM) Self: i'll be fine
(5:34:19 PM) Annaleisa: ciaos <3
TLDR:
She thinks antibiotics are harmful, and I should take (what is effectively Yakult - fermented milk) to treat an infection.
Seriously, how can someone be opposed to antibiotics? Vaccination, maybe, I can forgive - although it's hard to look past the damage done by polio, even though it was way before my time.
But antibiotics? Really?